Comments on: Orams lose Cyprus property court case

By: AwholeLottaRosie

AwholeLottaRosie — Fri, 09 Jul 2010 17:35:51 +0000

Why has the case been left until the villa is complete. Why didn’t the land owner sue the governing body who approved its build? If the land owner owns 10% of the overall plot how is that 10% proved to be where the villa is built.
It’s a case of attack the genuine people (the Brits) who do play by the rules, (Greece is Bankrupt and the people are complaining that the EEC and rest of the world are not prepared to continue to fund them).
If the EEC had followed its rules, as it did with Spain, with the Gibraltar (part of UK) border, then the GC part of Cyprus would not have been allowed to join due to the closed disputed border. The EEC court should have taken that fact into there consideration.
Had the EEC not allowed GC into the EEC then this whole sorry mess of a divided island would probably have been resolved, instead of mess getting worse. With the Cypriot people being able to move back to they lands or not as they wish.
Clearly time to join the UKIP.

By: Alan R

Alan R — Thu, 08 Jul 2010 21:25:21 +0000

This is a complex issue…(you don't say). My feeling is that having purchased a pre-74 turkish title deed property, the TRNC govt is morally and legally bankrupt by preventing me and my fellow owners from registering their title to the properties that they had bought from a developer.

There is no way forward for buyers – so beware. If the exchange title won't bite you, the TRNC government will anyway…

By: Peter Graham

Peter Graham — Tue, 06 Jul 2010 10:52:30 +0000

Thanks for the comments Christine, I think everyone knows the history of what happened in Cyprus and the different interpretations of what really happened and why the island was divided.

I think the Oram's have been used as poitical pawns to a point, and may have been badly advised or did not appreciate the situation to begin with.

The important thing is to move forward and find a solution to the division for the young of Cyprus so they can live together in peace in the future

By: Christine1820

Christine1820 — Tue, 06 Jul 2010 10:39:57 +0000

I have zero sympathy for the Orams, they should have known full well that they were entering an occupied territory which was taken by force and by gunpoint that bombs were dropped there forcing and displacing Cypriots in their own home. They were thoughtless and irresponsible in their endevours. As a result they lost what they invested, they should have been careful when dealing with the Northern part since it is not recognized by any international community, nor the UN and the Geneva Convention has been clear about the settelors as illegal persons on lands that belong to others. You want to live with war criminals then you are a criminal. Simply put. Thats why they lost. I'm glad that some justice has occured for the refugees of Cyprus.

A valid solution does not exist when the Northern invaders of Cyprus seek to have legal rights when everything about them is illegal. The did not settle there in a legal manner. You ask the miniorty to have more rights than the majority of real Cypriots who were there in the 70s and were forced out by gunpoint.

Politcal equality is difficult to find when the Cypriots lost their human rights and their homes on they day the Turks invaded. Cyprus is a member of the EU. Norther part of Cyprus is not recognized by the international communities because it is illegally settled and illegally occupied. Even Turkish Cypriots have left. Turkish settelors make so many demands and feel entitled to ask the Cypriots to give up so much. They gave up enough.

Even in May 2001 the European Court of Human Rights judged in the case of Cyprus v. Turkey that with regard to the homes and properties of displaced Greek Cypriots, Turkey was guilty of a continuing violation of Articles 8 and 13 of the European Convention on Human Rights, and Article 1 of Protocol 1.

By: Cleo

Cleo — Tue, 27 Apr 2010 16:28:36 +0000

I also feel bad for the Orams. But I like what Patricia Winter wrote " The judgment sent a strong message to all those who rushed to buy cheap Greek-Cypriot properties in the north – their status is not only illegal, but they risk being taken to court by the legitimate property owners."http://www.cyprus101.com/blogs/cleo_shahateet/arc...

By: Michael N

Michael N — Thu, 01 Apr 2010 06:17:53 +0000

All this talk tells me one thing: Stay away from buying property in north Cyprus. I was looking at websites that now give guarantees that they do own the land on which the houses are built in northern Cyprus, but how can one be sure?

Better stay out of Cyprus property market, north or south. I do love taking my hols there though… one can find good rental properties online

Sorry that the Orams got in the middle of this and even more sorry for the Greeks that lost their properties to Turkey's invation. They are such nice people

By: Philippios E

Philippios E — Wed, 31 Mar 2010 19:28:20 +0000

And to Marie B:

Lets say that you are a Hotel owner in the Falklands, that being YOUR ONLY single asset; Argentine invades and takes over your hotel and you barely make it back alive in the UK. From a businesswoman in your own right, you become a waitress, you have children and a family to support and you have to do 2-3 jobs to make ends meet for the rest of your life.

Many years after you find out that some EU Nationals, even UK nationals, are booking into your Hotel which now has an Argentine "owner" who never sweat to build up that hotel from scratch. And this "owner" is making money out of your hotel and on your back and he calls it "his" hotel. REMEMBER you got No compensation whatsoever, neither from the Argentine nor the UK Government. You only left with the clothes you wore at the time…

Are you feeling enraged at all? May be not because you haven/t been through all these for 36 odd years…but there are about 200,000 G/c's and about 100,000T/c's who have suffered exactly that for more than 35 years now…….all because Turkey decided to invade.

By: PokerNetwork

PokerNetwork — Wed, 31 Mar 2010 19:27:52 +0000

Hi there, thanks for the comments,
The situation is a very difficult one and i think the Orams were unaware or misled as have been many people regarding property in North Cyprus.
The main objective now has to be finding an answer to the problem that exists now, hopefully the leaders can find a solution.

By: Philippios E

Philippios E — Wed, 31 Mar 2010 19:16:39 +0000

The Difference lies in the treatment of Properties in both the Northern Occupied areas by the T/c "Administration" and the Government (in the free areas) of the Republic of Cyprus. The former has taken land that never belonged to them and illegally (without consulting the original owners) re-distributed it to T/c's using Fake newly-issued deeds (of an illegal, non-existent "state"); the latter i.e. the ROC gave to eligible refugee G/c's in terms of long term rental contracts, property belonging to T/c's (a fraction of the Property left behind by the G/c's) BUT (here is the difference) without the G/c having any title deeds or rights on the said T/c Property…..They are regarded as tenants, not owners, the ROC is the Guardian of all T/c Properties and cannot be sold, whereas in the North, the T/c's that got hold of such G/c Property (without the G/c's owner's approval) sold them on to other parties, including EU citizens, deliberately making this more perplexed, involving more & more parties into the argument; the reason is simple; they do not want a single G/c to be able to return to his former house/area etc. This was done to perplex the problem even further.

As an example, Would Anyone accept being the legal owner of a 4bd Luxury Villa in the North and 36 years later on, exchange it for a barn or for nothing except a pat in the back and be friends again??? If you fully understand this argument, then you can realise how Apostolides feels, how every G/c feels and why there is no magic solution to the problem. The Orams or any Orams family should be a lot better if they hadn't been caught in the Turkish trap, did their homework and read the history first and should not have purchased the G/c property in the first place.

By: Philippios E

Philippios E — Wed, 31 Mar 2010 17:16:12 +0000

But there was never (a formal or informal) exchange that took place, don't you realize that?? The T/c leadership side has tricked T/c's that had land in the free areas in the Republic to "exchange" it with G/c-owned land (proportionate or not) in the North. Was the G/c Owner asked? No. Was the T/c that "got" the G/c's land even the true owner of that land? No.
So what is clearer than this to you people??